Thursday, September 24, 2009

Which Cards would you Ban Poll Results - Metagame Update - Ban List Update

(Anther Great Metagame, Konami reigns in the heat to let us play on a leveled playing field. If you're a player of skill you just received an early birthday gift.)


Fire days allow us west coasters to actually get a break from the hectic beat of the world. There are still snow days all around California, and even Southern Cali, but they're impossible in my particular neck of the woods.

Regardless a huge update had to come sooner and later, especially after a ban list. Lets get to the results:

Which of the following cards would you ban?

Monster Reborn
80 (11%)
Crush Card Virus
201 (27%)
Judgment Dragon
196 (27%)
Charge of the Light Brigade
88 (12%)
Heavy Storm
44 (6%)
Dark Armed Dragon
91 (12%)
Mirror force
44 (6%)
Brain Control
65 (8%)
Torrential Tribute
35 (4%)
Blackwing Armor Master
65 (8%)
Rescue Cat
161 (22%)
Test Tiger
71 (9%)
Solemn Judgment
81 (11%)
Dark Strike Fighter
317 (43%)
None of the Above
87 (12%)

Votes so far: 723
Poll closed


~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ranked
  • 1) Dark Strike ~ 43%
  • 2) Crush Card Virus ~ 27%
  • 3) Judgment Dragon ~ 27%
  • 4) Rescue Cat ~ 22%
  • 5) Dark Armed Dragon ~ 12%
  • 6) Charge of the Light Brigade ~ 12%
  • 7) None of the Above ~ 12% ***********
  • 8) Solemn Judgment ~ 11%
  • 9) Monster Reborn ~ 11%
  • 10) Test Tiger ~ 9%
  • 11) Blackwing Armor Master ~ 8%
  • 12) Brain Control ~ 8%
  • 13) Heavy Storm ~ 6%
  • 14) Mirror Force ~ 6%
  • 15) Torrential Tribute ~ 4%

Red= Banned
Blue= Limited
Green = Anomaly
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ban List v.s Poll

So how did our poll fare against the actual ban list? The most significant items of interest were indeed banned. Dark strike and Crush it seemed could not survive in our new era and as a result were kicked to the curb.

The limited cards a bit more interesting though. You'd expect them to be right after the cards that were banned but that trend isn't exactly as it should be.

4 things remained sandwiched in between the cards that were limited and they were:
  • 1) Judgment Dragon
  • 2) Dark Armed Dragon
  • 3) Charge of the Light brigade
  • 4) No changes to the list
None of the above choices were taken into effect by Konami and each deserves it's own section of analysis.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Judgment Dragon & Charge of the Light Brigade

Judgment dragon, logically looking from the poll should have been banned or limited at the very least. Yet what did Konami end up doing? For the second Ban list in a row lightsworn was unaffected.

So what were the effects of that back in March? Were lightsworn on top, was UniMetagame's Analysis wrong? No, as predicted, Lightsworn was too inconsistent to win any SJC and frequently got out topped by Rescue cat, glads, and Blackwings.

The same pattern emerges now. Again Lightsworn is not on top, and still Lightsworn is too inconsistent to win an SJC. Since the Sneak peak, til now, no one has gotten higher than 3rd place at our local Tournies and played Lightsworn.

After the sneak and before the ban list you could blame that on Gottoms and being able to play 3 rescue cat's and 3 one for one's. But since then, til basically the end of this month, there is no scapegoat. Who do we blame for the lack of Lightsworn at the top? What do we blame? It's inconsistency, plain and simple, and we have enough data by now to stop the bickering.

Regardless off all of this though, the reason why lightsworn got polled as the most hated deck in the game by 2 different sites and over 750 votes, and the reason why Lightsworn's Judgment Dragon is continuosly attacked is for one reason:

They explode too unfairly and Luck sack more consistently than any other deck alive.

It has been that way for more than a year and while Konami understand that we hate OTK decks, they do not understand that we hate Luck sacking even more.

To play every single turn right, and watch your opponent make mistake after mistake and still coming out the victor because of 1 or 2 cards, is completely unjust and takes a huge portion of fun out of the game.

Konami needs to deal with this right away or by the next ban list, all the people who complained will be gone instead of just annoyed.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dark Armed Dragon

This becomes more of an opinionated call really. Is it just too powerful to counter against or is it too hard to bring out, and draw, to worry about? Honestly I can't speak for everyone but Dark Armed Dragon doesn't lose me games.

If you go into a game without a way to deal with cards like Dark Armed, then you probably won't do very well anyways. No one can probably say that their deck is well suited against every other deck and yet for some reason it can't handle Dark Armed.

Dark armed isn't that special and the way you deal with it is about the same as a lot of cards. Also Dark armed punishes players for not playing chainable traps.

My personal verdict, at 1, it's an annoyance but you should be able to take it down pretty quickly. There's always one pesky and strong monster in a particular type of deck and for most dark decks that ends up being Dark Armed. There is one last note though, and that has to do with the future and with Dark Simorgh. If Dark armed in the future is too easily comboed with another deck, possibly a Dark Simorgh one, then it will have a reason to be banned because it's ability to come out would be too easy. As long as it remains challenging to bring out, it should remain in play.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Nothing Banned on the List

What can I say about these players who voted that way. What can I say to the players that consider Dark Strike and 3 Rescue cats a good thing? What can I say to the people begging Konami to allow broken decks to rule the land?

Honestly what can we do with players who don't care about Yugioh and only care about winning.

What should we as a community do with the players who are too lazy to try and win on their own and would rather broken decks live so they can luck their way to glory?

To such players I ask: Do you want a horrible game? Do you want it unbalanced? Do you want it completely luck based? Are you scared of skill? Do you have any skill? Is that why you rely so much on luck?

According to the poll these leeches made up about 12% of the voters. These lazy, skilless, lifeless leeches who want nothing to do with the game and care only about winning, were a very strong base.

Now this isn't intended at anyone who likes to win, but for those who would keep Dark strike alive and keep Rescue cat at 3, something the VAST majority of the community disagrees with. Why do they disagree, because they want a balanced game.

Most of the community wants:
  • 1) Skill
  • 2) Patience
  • 3) Actual Deck Building
  • 4) Fun
  • 5) Originality
The Majority of the community is strongly in favor of the above 5 tenants. The problem is we still have the 12% of leeches who want to chip away at the others. These leeches also were the loudest heard in the past. Luckily Konami doesn't pay much attention to such foolish people and the ban list was much more balanced than said leeches would have liked.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

The Ban List and Brain Control

The last significant topics remaining are the overall view of the new ban list and Brain control.

Brain control probably wasn't banned because there isn't enough information about why it should be banned in the first place. If the vast majority of the yugioh community knew and read about it's power, by now it would be banned. Hopefully this will occur by the next ban list but no one can say for sure if it will happen.

For analysis as to why Brain control should be banned and to help the community trend in that direction check out one of our recent articles dedicated to this topic.

The Ban list though gets a very strong grade.
The most significant positives included:

1) Solemn at 1
2) Mind control at 1
3) Monster reborn banned
4) Rescue cat totally annihilated
5) Card of Safe gone
6) Chaos Sorcerer at 2

The only critique really that can be given is that D Draw probably shouldn't have hit 3 and Brain control definitely should not have been allowed to stick around.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

New Poll

A new poll has now graced the front page of the site. It will run for at least a week and depending on the voting result it'll either continue to run for another week or a new poll will be put up.

It says:

How do you feel about Konami's themed decks? (Gladiator beasts, Lightsworn, Blackwings)

1) Do away with the powerful, unoriginal, pre-built, easy to play decks.
2) Keep them coming in the new packs.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Final Thoughts - An ode to Zombie players

As a final note, and to all zombie players, I'm glad Mezuki is back at 3 so zombie players have false hope that they can actually win an SJC this cycle.

Originality has been removed from zombies for years and there should be some punishment for being a zombie player in one of the most original meta's we've ever had.

That punishment is manifested in the false hope of 3 mezuki's actually beating the rest of the community. Enjoy your hope and maybe by the next ban list those zombie players will finally change to something more original and slightly fun.

This is Yugioh, you play to have fun. Most players don't play zombies to have fun; most players play zombies to win.

In this Meta, they'll do neither.

9 comments:

Vman said...

Your analysis of the archetypes in yugioh is full of incomplete data. You talk about how unoriginal and uncreative the decks built around these archetypes are, but you only look at a select few, namely GBeasts, Lightsworn,Blackwing, and...wait is there anything else you complain about? Not really, despite the fact that plenty of archetypes are out there that are comepletely ignored. Skull servants, Frogs, Batterymen, D.D.s, Morphtronics, even Phantom Beasts, are all archetypes, but do you discuss how broken they are? No, you only mention anything on the top, and group everything together. Yes, GB, Blackwing, and Lightsworn are completely overpowered, but they're only a small spectrum. As for matters of creativity and comboing, how many light monsters are there that are actually used other than in lightsworn? Honest, Thunder King, and other staples that would form the core of Type and Attribute themed decks. They can be played differently with entirely different ways of winning in both the archetypes and as a general theme, and the only reason why the themes get such a bad rep for being unoriginal is the same thing that would happen if you took away the archetypes: POEPLE ARE LAZY. They copy the best deck around in the hopes of winning. Let's assume the best deck was Fariy Beatdown. It is garunteed that a thousand of those decks would be running around just like today. For example, recently I played GB, but unlike the their normal control, I ran a hugely successful black garden GB. How is that original? I used other cards in combo with them. The same principle is behind stuff like zombies. They all use sombie master, how unoriginal or whatever, but they're used in different ways. Zombieworld decks, straight beatdown zombies, skull servants, skill drain zombies, OTK zombies, heck I've even seen some wierd but awesome RFG Zombies. The point is that they all share a lot of the same cards (Zombie Master, Pyramid Turtle, Book of Life, etc.), but the creativity put into them is what is translated into theme decks when someone actually puts the effort into designing a new way for them to function, just like type theme or attribute themes. The themes also help new players to the game.

Vman said...

Think about it, newbs don't know the rules, much less how to combo crap they haven't even heard about. It's easier to learn from things that come together and say "This is how the game works." This is how I got started, then when I learned how to play, I made my own decks to varying success at locals. It's not the theme that's the problem, it is and always has been the lazy people who directly copy others. I realize this may sound like I'm attacking you, but I'm not. I'm trying to focus your anger at the actual problem. To try and help you understand what I'm saying think of the old riddle: the stove is on, a lamp is burning, and something else is wrong (okay, I don't remember exactly how it goes), what do you deal with first? None of them, the house is on fire. Lazy people are the house. It seems like your too mad mad at what's being copied, not what's copying them. Back to the conversation,Whenever a theme is successful, it is immediately copied, which leads to more stuff being released for it, which in turn causes a mob asking for it o die. What happens when the copies lose? You get the exact situation that happened for GBs: They ran rampant until e-tele was released. Then the only thing played was tele-DAD. Tele-DAD isn't an archetype. It's based on a card that uses type,not namesake, and was the ONLY thing that everyone (meaning all the people that played GBs) started playing. It stayed that way for at least a year, until new cards were released. Why are the GBs hated? They were successful enough to get new cards for them (yeah, we're all looking at you gyzarus). But if being the dominant deck is the reason why they were hated, then why isn't Tele-DAD hated? It's because it was viewed as "de-throning" the GBs. There was about as much creativity in tele-DAD as there was in Glad Beasts. Archetypes shouldn't be banned, nor should more not be made. The two faults here are 1)the creators of game and 2)the people who don't want to play anything other than the top deck. I hope you get what I'm trying to say with this mountain of text: this is nothing against you, I only feel that your decision about themes is misdirected.

UniMetagame said...

I understand completely what you mean and I appreciate the input you added. Size is fine with me; the more you write the more interested I am.

I can see how you say that themes are just mediums for lazy players and if we got rid of them we'd still have lazy players playing the top decks.

I completely agree with that and understand where you're coming from.

But decks like Tele-Dad are rare really, and we'll get less teledads and cat synchro's than konami can turn out Lightsworns, blackwings, and glads.

It's much easier for them to make a very powerful theme than it is for us to think of one, that is fairly static, like teledad.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In the end you're right about how the house is on fire and it's the lazy people in the first place that are the cause of this problem.

I just don't want Konami aggrevating the problem with powerful themes. Being that they have the power of creation, they can fudge the rules in the card text to make some really powerful and unfair builds.

What's even worse than Konami making broken decks is Konami forcing us to buy horrible deck types that get no support for years.

All and All I'm o.k with the themes dissapearing, and I can handle the communities slow rate of creation of TeleDad like decks.

Right now, we have both, and working as a team we've been up against:

1) Teledad
2) Cat Synchro
3) Glads
4) Salvo Dekoichi OTK
5) Lightsworn
6) Blackwings

That team work has to end and konami needs to leave the theme business. They manufacture too many unfair or luck driven decks.

Thanks again for your input Vman, definitely keep it coming! This site is all about discussion and communication.

Jose said...

Actually as many of you and i think is that the problem is not themed decks by itselfs is just a matter of how not to be creative, I mean the other day I saw a kid buy a entire blackwing deck and when he plays against my ritual shinato deck he failed horrible is not the deck in fact is just a matter of skill, but the main think is that if you play against any other meta deck based on luck or revolves on one single combo that leaves a felling of god why is this happening to me!!! specially lets say that you are about to win and you have the corrects cards in the field and in your hand and then puf!! a selfish Judgement dragon appears and blow all the field and reduce your life points to zero just because your opponent was lucky enough to draw the card and blam, I think that konami should pay more atencion on what type of monsters they create and I'm not talking about the yugioh monsters, just like the young boy of the other day that spend a lot of money to have a deck without any skill and any effort....

Anonymous said...

You ever notice that the decks that completely dominate the game (Chaos, DDT, Troop Dupe, TeleDAD, DAD Return, Cat) aren't themed?

UniMetagame said...

The above poster has very short term memory. They also have obviously not looked at the results of our First SJC in Orlando.

1) If the above poster actually remembered history, he would remember the onslaught of glads that went on for nearly a year.

Playing anything but glads, Before lightsworn came out, was hopeless.

2) Then Lightsworn went on top just barely edging out glads, right when it's pack was released till teledad hit.

3) As of SJC Orlando, The Vast Majority of decks that top 16, were Lightsworn. As of round 7, 11 of the top 20 were Lightsworn, with every other deck type numbering 2 or less...

2 deck types versus 11 lightsworns, what an amazing ratio.

The winning deck was a small blackwing variant known as Vayu Turbo, which is 99% blackwings with Dark Armed and Dark Grephor.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Glads Dominated, Lightsworn Dominated , and now Blackwings Dominate with Lightsworn right behind.

With all that data the above poster still says player decks always dominate over Konami?

The data is just too strong to be overwritten by one person's opinion. Konami has lead the Meta in the past and it's definitely leading the Meta right now.

Jose said...

So basicaly if you don't want to run a konami deck you are done!!??I deny on this I look over and over again and all that I've found is people playing "lightworms, glads and now blackwings", but what about the other cheaps decks like morphtronics they are pretty good and can be deadly if u let them run but cuz they are not the top almost anybody put an eye on it, and believe me I've seen a lot of this top decks fail horrible in front of small decks like the frogs and the batteries,but there are the other people, like me that use my own creation of beat-monarch and my original deck of ritual shinato deck, and we look not just to win we enjoy playing, and these themed decks makes the people does not want to play it makes them want to win no matter what even if have to copy the idea of somebody else...

Anonymous said...

"1) If the above poster actually remembered history, he would remember the onslaught of glads that went on for nearly a year."

The Glad format lasted for about three months, between the E-ban of Dimension Fusion and the release of TDGS/new banlist.



"2) Then Lightsworn went on top just barely edging out glads, right when it's pack was released till teledad hit."

Glads beat Lightsworn during LODT because LS had no Charge and Glads had 3 Bestiaris for Gyzarus spam.



"3) As of SJC Orlando, The Vast Majority of decks that top 16, were Lightsworn. As of round 7, 11 of the top 20 were Lightsworn, with every other deck type numbering 2 or less..."

Glads won the first Jump of the TeleDAD format. Six Sam won during DAD Return. Crazy things can happen.



"Glads Dominated, Lightsworn Dominated , and now Blackwings Dominate with Lightsworn right behind."

Glads dominated for a relatively short amount of time. Lightsworn never dominated. Blackwings have won only their second Jump since having most of their stuff for 3-4 months and hardly dominated the tournament.



OP seems butthurt.

Jose said...

ja ja ja someone is pissed off!!!

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